2000 Xterra - No Start Condition

[sandor]

Seeing as it's a little cold outside right now, and the Xterra doesn't come anywhere close to fitting in the garage (not to mention the garage is full of other non-running vehicles), I want to see if I can skip a few troubleshooting steps and determine the root cause a little faster.

After the last fill-up, the truck seemed to chug a bit every now and then; could be just a coincidence. No check engine light, but at pretty much any steady rpm, it was stumbling, only occasionally. Engine revved fine with no signs of hesitation or power loss. Acceleration was fine, but maintaining speed exhibited some stumbling. No check engine light or DTC codes stored; over 3/4 of a tank of gas.

Engine stalled as I came up to a stop light, and won't start. Engine turns over, but won't fire. I don't smell any gas, and I don't have any DTC codes, so I am thinking it's the fuel pump. There was also a recall for the fuel pump on early first gens for corroded wiring; I have no idea if this has been addressed.

Planning on replacing the fuel filter today, and while the old one is off, going to turn the key to Run position to see if the fuel pump wants to build pressure in the system...I can't hear it from inside, so a visual will help confirm. It could also be a bad coil or distributor; seems like there are known issues for that with the first gens, however I thought I would get a DTC for that.

Anyone else know of any other common no start issues with a 2000 Xterra, 3,3L, 5 spd? I'd rather stay warm than spend hours outside in the cold, and I don't particularly like the notion of gasoline soaked work gloves, or frozen hands.

[Snafu]

I have not had that happen with my first gen but if you can't hear the fuel pump from the cab that would be a good place to start. Make sure the pump is getting power.

[Adam]

Usually if it is quiet enough around you, you can cycle the key on and off with the door open and you'll hear the pump. If you don't I'd start there. If it is working and you have pressure at the rail I would then check the distributor. Most of the time with the dizzy it will run fine when cold, and then like a bag of poop when hot, and get progressively worse. But I guess it's possible that it just gave up the ghost in short order.

Does the X have an access door under the seat or cargo floor like the pathy's do? That makes troubleshooting easier as you can at least sit inside out of the wind.

[sandor]

Thanks Adam...I agree, normally you can hear the fuel pump if you listen carefully, but either this one is super quiet, or it's not turning on. If so, could be wiring (known issue at pump connector), relay, or the pump itself.

You have to remove the seat bottoms to fold down the back seats on the X, and yes there is an access panel right there. The fuel filter is readily accessible underneath the vehicle, right by the tank; it's super rusty, so I am assuming it hasn't been changed in a while. While I am changing it, I'm going to see if there is any fuel flowing with the key in the RUN position.

Do you know if the Distributor would fail without a DTC?

[Simon]

Mine did that when the distributor went. All at once....no codes, and no start. Stumbled a few times then died at a light. I did get it to re-start, and limped it home, but never got it to start again. Pulled it out, pulled the cap and rotor, and the coil cover, and found bearing bits in there

[sandor]

Thanks Simon,

It's not the fuel pump...good gas flow when in the RUN position, so I guess distributor is my next check. Any way to test, or just inspect with cap/rotor/coil cover removed?

Where's a good place to source a new distributor?

[Adam]

I got mine on amazon, there was another link, but they don't have anymore in stock.

https://www.amazon.ca/2000-2004-Nissan- ... istributor

I would take it apart like Simon says. Mine had brown bearing dust everywhere.

Good to know there is an access panel. Have never folded the seats on my xterra yet lol. I wonder what surprises await under there.

[sandor]

OK guys and gals, next question...what to set the base timing at?

For some reason, Nissan set the base ignition timing for the 2000 model year differently than 2001-2004. FSM says that base timing, with TPS unplugged, for 2000 is 15+/-2; 2001-04 is 10+/-2.

My truck is a 2000 (US model), but I know the engine has been replaced, and I have no clue what year that engine is. It has 4 cats (2000's only had 2 cats in Canada), so it's either a California emissions 2000, or not an engine from a 2000...at least the exhaust is not. Honestly no clue.

...but does that matter? I assume the ECU is still original to the 2000 (possibly a bad assumption), and that is what is controlling the engine, including the timing.

So, do I set it at 15 because that is what the ECU is flashed for, or do I set it at 10 because Nissan discovered something in the first year that made them change it...probably fuel economy and emissions.

What would you do?

[Snafu]

I would check with Morpheus for this kind of info unless you have access to another Nissan tech.

I had 4 cats on my 01 Frontier but just because they replaced the engine does not mean they would have changed the exhaust but this depends on what they swapped out.

Like a typical rod project, it is always good to know the years for the stuff added. It makes for getting parts and repairs easier. Try to find out the year of the ECU/flash and engine (google should help ya there).

As a guess I would put the timing at around 12-13. That is within the ranges for the timing and it should allow the engine to start. Better to have the timing a little retarded than too advanced for starting. It would get ya going until you can find out the info on the engine and ecu/flash

[sandor]

Yeah, slowly making an inventory on what make/model/year parts are on this Frankenstein Monster; it's hard with non-popular models. Decoding part #s is easy on popular vehicles; not so easy on most Nissans, especially the Xterra.

I've read that someone changed their 2000 from 15 to 10, and they thought it ran better / got better fuel economy. With only 5 degrees between the two, the truck should start and idle fine at either setting, and once the TPS is plugged in, the ECU is going to take over timing anyways. It will totally be drive-able, just wondering if anyone had experience with timing on other vehicles, and provide a recommendation.

[Adam]

15 degrees would have more power than 10. I think 10 is for the supercharged and 15 is for the non supercharged. 3.3 r50 pathy's use 15 and same with the old 3.0 pathys.

I would run 15. All VG33E are the same block/pistons/heads except for the supercharged models, and even then I think it is just the pistons and valves that are different. I believe Slavek is running an r50 pathfinder engine in his X now.

Interesting fact:

The VG33ER valves are ceramic coated from the factory which is pretty darned cool. They also don't have the Nissan logo on their faces like virtually all Nissan valves clear back to the '60s. Smooth valve faces is a good thing as there are no 'hot spots' to cause detonation.

Neat thread with tons of info.

http://www.nissanpathfinders.net/forum/ ... /?p=593884

Slightly related anecdote; on my 94 pathfinder, the distributor shaft top part was not set properly, so the timing would be wrong no matter how you set it. I drove it for a month at 20+ degrees and it was fine. It actually had quite a bit more pep like that. I didn't hear any pinging and I ran 91 just in case.

[sandor]

Thanks Adam, just the sort of info I was looking for. VG33ER was not available in 2001, and that FSM states 10, so the 15 vs 10 is likely not N/A vs SC.

I'll start off with 15 and see how it goes.

[Adam]

Odd. My 2002 FSM says 10 degrees +/- 2 for the NA. And the SC is 10 degrees +/- 1 degree. Not sure how you could get that exact with the timing lights most of us probably have...

[the x kid]

Any progress?

Sent from my SM-N900W8 using Tapatalk

[sandor]

Got parts before Christmas, but had to wait until I had time, and the weather co-operated.

Took no time at all to rip out the old distributor, and put the new one in; took longer to replace all the spark plug wires. Once installed, with the throttle position sensor disconnected, the truck fired right up. While the truck was warming up to operating temp, I looked at the old distributor; although it spun, it would not spin freely, and sounded like coarse sandpaper on metal when rotating in one direction, and fingernails on a chalkboard in the other direction. I don't need to tear it down to know that was the culprit.

Once at operating temperature, I checked the base timing, and it was pretty close... about 18 degrees. I set it to 15 degrees, plugged back in the throttle position sensors, and took it for a quick spin; it seems to drive fine. I'll monitor and possibly change it to 10 when it's nicer out to see if there is any difference in drive-ability.

[the x kid]

Good to hear.

Sent from my SM-N900W8 using Tapatalk

[Bow_Tied]

Out of curiosity why would you lower it to 10 - or is that spec?

[sandor]

15 is spec for 2000 Xterra's, 10 is spec for 2001-04 Xterra's. While the truck is a 2000 model, it has had the engine replaced, and because it has 4 cats, it wasn't from a 2000 model Xterra...those only had 2 cats.

ECU is probably original (from an 00); engine is most likely from a 01+. Went with 15 because I believe that's what the ECU is expecting. 50:50 chance of being correct; if driveability sucks, 10 it is.

[Bow_Tied]

Ah gotcha. I guess the difference will be how much the ECU advances the timing at part throttle as the engines are otherwise the same for cam and head specs, yes? If so, then the total timing would be the same. I presume the distributors are the same for those years?

[sandor]

I assume there were no major differences in the engines...camshafts have the same P/N for 00-04 for N/A engines...distributor is the same for all 3.3L Nissans including R50's and WD22's.